New Savage KLYM

[Dave Hoback]

Good post. (Except about the Impulse. I’m not a fan. I think straight pulls are an answer to a question that Nobody asked! I’m still trying to figure out what exactly it is they do better:confused: But that’s just me & I digress.)

Jim said it perfectly. You want/need a lightweight rig, grab a 110 Lightweight Storm. It’s like 6.5oz lighter than this KLYM & you’ll save yourself $1800 bucks! You like the stock? Take some of that saved $1800 & get a similar one. Then just plan on getting a Proof CF when you do a rebarrrel.

[Txhillbilly]

What the heck is Savage thinking? Only a die hard Savage fan or an idiot would pay $2k+ for a Savage action rifle. There are dozen's of Custom rifle's that can be had for that price, and they have non of the problems that a Savage action gives you out of the box.

[charlie b]

I consider straight pulls like lever actions. When you can't have (or don't want) a semi-auto but you still want a 'fast' action.

They were popular in Germany when I was stationed there. I figured it had something to do with their rules. I know the hunter qualification course included some fairly fast moving targets.

Savage has survived a long time even while shooting themselves in the foot. I don't understand their reasoning, but, maybe someone does. FWIW, if I look at gun shelves I'll see 10 or 20 of the lower end Savages and every now and then I'll see on of the more expensive, usually one of the chassis guns. I suspect for every 1000 Axis they sell they will sell one KLYM.

After spending the money for the BVSS I know I won't do that again.

[Turkeytider]

What the heck is Savage thinking? Only a die hard Savage fan or an idiot would pay $2k+ for a Savage action rifle. There are dozen's of Custom rifle's that can be had for that price, and they have non of the problems that a Savage action gives you out of the box.
FWIW, because of the good experience that I`ve had with my 110 Storm in .223 (once I worked through some magazine/feeding issues. Must be a right of passage for anyone buying a Savage rifle) and 93R17, I went ahead and purchased a Model 12 LRPV for my first range gun. It`s a well made, accurate shooter IMO. I paid $1,400 for that gun brand new. I wouldn`t pay a penny more than that for a Savage rifle, and I`m pretty sure I wouldn`t have to hunt very hard to find folks who would say I was nuts to pay that for ANY Savage rifle. If I`m going to spend 2K+ for a rifle, there are just too many better options out there.

[Dave Hoback]

What the heck is Savage thinking? Only a die hard Savage fan or an idiot would pay $2k+ for a Savage action rifle. There are dozen's of Custom rifle's that can be had for that price, and they have non of the problems that a Savage action gives you out of the box.


Ok, :o Maybe let’s ease up a bit. We don’t need to refer to people with disparaging comments because of their choices. While I do think it’s a waste of money, I’m not going to call someone an idiot for their decision. Granted, I also believe spending several thousand $$ on Glass is wasteful as well. Spending $3K, $4K or even $5K or more, does nothing to improve accuracy over an already working optic. However, I’m not going to call someone a name for their choice in buying whatever.

[Turkeytider]

Ok, :o Maybe let’s ease up a bit. We don’t need to refer to people with disparaging comments because of their choices. While I do think it’s a waste of money, I’m not going to call someone an idiot for their decision. Granted, I also believe spending several thousand $$ on Glass is wasteful as well. Spending $3K, $4K or even $5K or more, does nothing to improve accuracy over an already working optic. However, I’m not going to call someone a name for their choice in buying whatever.

Agree. Let`s not go down the same road as another well known, long range shooting web site goes down on pretty much daily basis when it comes to personally disparaging folks.

[shoots100]

Ok, :o Maybe let’s ease up a bit. We don’t need to refer to people with disparaging comments because of their choices. While I do think it’s a waste of money, I’m not going to call someone an idiot for their decision. Granted, I also believe spending several thousand $$ on Glass is wasteful as well. Spending $3K, $4K or even $5K or more, does nothing to improve accuracy over an already working optic. However, I’m not going to call someone a name for their choice in buying whatever.
I agree, it's the same way I feel about turn bolt rifle fanatics using 200 year old rifle technology, but to each his own.:blah:

[Dave Hoback]

I agree, it's the same way I feel about turn bolt rifle fanatics using 200 year old rifle technology, but to each his own.:blah:


LOL! Do you think the Straight Pull is so much more modern? If so, I suggest you do some more research. The Bolt Action & Straight Pull Rifles were made roughly 50 years apart- Both still in the 19th century! So, is your contention that 200 year old tech is prehistoric, but 150 year old, well now that ​is somehow cutting edge?

[shoots100]

We know the Impulse KLYM is ready to go out of the box, can we say the same for the 110 KLYM turn bolt ?

[Dave Hoback]

That’s a fair point. But that wasn’t your argument. You simply said we were “Turn Bolt Fanatics using 200 year old rifle technology.” And I simply answered that the Straight Pull is 150 year old technology.

But now you are changing your argument to the Impulse being able to work correctly out of the box & the 110 will not, correct? Well, the 110 may have issues & it may not. However, what we know is all issues, whatever they may be, can be remedied. And it stands to reason than many more Savage 110’s function just fine when new, than those which have problems. If you are happy with your out of the box Impulse, I’m happy for you. I would not be. I’m quite happy with my hand built & extensively modified Model 10. With its wonderful 200 year old Turn Bolt it functions beautifully. Having minimal bolt lift which cost me little more than my time working on it. Not to mention all modifications performed were a pleasure for me, as I look at the hands on aspect as being part of the hobby. I know you have also performed modifications to your Impulse. And I commend you for it. I’m not against the Impulse. It simply does nothing for me. It’s just not a 110. Doesn’t have the rich history & extensive background of the 110. Being the oldest rifle still produced in the United States. Having seen extensive combat. And being the first rifle to utilize a barrel nut. A system so long being frowned upon, and now many franchises taking advantage of the same system. All these things mean something to me.

But it’s ok if we disagree. I only ask that you take care in spreading incorrect historical tech. :tea:

[J.Baker]

Good post. (Except about the Impulse. I’m not a fan. I think straight pulls are an answer to a question that Nobody asked! I’m still trying to figure out what exactly it is they do better:confused: But that’s just me & I digress.)

Jim said it perfectly. You want/need a lightweight rig, grab a 110 Lightweight Storm. It’s like 6.5oz lighter than this KLYM & you’ll save yourself $1800 bucks! You like the stock? Take some of that saved $1800 & get a similar one. Then just plan on getting a Proof CF when you do a rebarrrel.

Anyone with any common sense who's looking to spend $2,700 on an ultralite rifle isn't going to be looking at a Savage. For that kind of money you can get a Browning X-Bolt Mountain Pro SPR, a Christiansen Arms Ridgeline FFT, a Kimber Mountain Ascent, a Seekins Havak Element, or for just a few hundred more go the full custom route with a titanium 700-clone action, proof barrel and CF stock. The 110 action as-delivered just doesn't match up to these similarly priced options IMO. I'll throw my prediction out there now - both these rifles will be discontinued after just 2-3 years (maybe even after just 1 if they have supply issues with the European stock maker).

On another note, has anyone else notice the "carbon fiber" stock Savage shows is only CF on the buttstock and forearm while the area under the action and the grip isn't CF on both the 110 and the Impulse variants? At first I thought this middle area was HDPE the same as all the Savage synthetic stocks, but then when I looked at the high-res images from Savage's Press area I noticed on the Impulse there's a badge right on it that says the mid section is 3D printed.

10167
(click to enlarge)
10168
(click to enlarge)

What I question is how strong the union is between the mid-section and the CF buttstock, especially at that top connection point which is pretty thin.


Oh - and in case anyone missed it, Savage is now showing a new "AccuCan" and "AccuBipod" in the slideshow on their homepage.

[Turkeytider]

That’s a fair point. But that wasn’t your argument. You simply said we were “Turn Bolt Fanatics using 200 year old rifle technology.” And I simply answered that the Straight Pull is 150 year old technology.

But now you are changing your argument to the Impulse being able to work correctly out of the box & the 110 will not, correct? Well, the 110 may have issues & it may not. However, what we know is all issues, whatever they may be, can be remedied. And it stands to reason than many more Savage 110’s function just fine when new, than those which have problems. If you are happy with your out of the box Impulse, I’m happy for you. I would not be. I’m quite happy with my hand built & extensively modified Model 10. With its wonderful 200 year old Turn Bolt it functions beautifully. Having minimal bolt lift which cost me little more than my time working on it. Not to mention all modifications performed were a pleasure for me, as I look at the hands on aspect as being part of the hobby. I know you have also performed modifications to your Impulse. And I commend you for it. I’m not against the Impulse. It simply does nothing for me. It’s just not a 110. Doesn’t have the rich history & extensive background of the 110. Being the oldest rifle still produced in the United States. Having seen extensive combat. And being the first rifle to utilize a barrel nut. A system so long being frowned upon, and now many franchises taking advantage of the same system. All these things mean something to me.

But it’s ok if we disagree. I only ask that you take care in spreading incorrect historical tech. :tea:

Dave, speaking of 110`s at war, 110 actions were/are in use in Ukraine as sniper rifles. I suspect, though, that they`ve moved on from those by now for the most part.

[Dave Hoback]

Anyone with any common sense who's looking to spend $2,700 on an ultralite rifle isn't going to be looking at a Savage. For that kind of money you can get a Browning X-Bolt Mountain Pro SPR, a Christiansen Arms Ridgeline FFT, a Kimber Mountain Ascent, a Seekins Havak Element, or for just a few hundred more go the full custom route with a titanium 700-clone action, proof barrel and CF stock. The 110 action as-delivered just doesn't match up to these similarly priced options IMO. I'll throw my prediction out there now - both these rifles will be discontinued after just 2-3 years (maybe even after just 1 if they have supply issues with the European stock maker).

On another note, has anyone else notice the "carbon fiber" stock Savage shows is only CF on the buttstock and forearm while the area under the action and the grip isn't CF on both the 110 and the Impulse variants? At first I thought this middle area was HDPE the same as all the Savage synthetic stocks, but then when I looked at the high-res images from Savage's Press area I noticed on the Impulse there's a badge right on it that says the mid section is 3D printed.

10167
(click to enlarge)
10168
(click to enlarge)

What I question is how strong the union is between the mid-section and the CF buttstock, especially at that top connection point which is pretty thin.


Oh - and in case anyone missed it, Savage is now showing a new "AccuCan" and "AccuBipod" in the slideshow on their homepage.


Noticed the same thing right away. Does look kinda flimsy. But it’s the CF that is the long part. It’s amazing how this CF can be taken & still be so strong. However, the price is even more unreasonable with the stock not being 100% CF. We’ll see if your prediction comes to fruition. Although, I’m wondering if they don’t just end up dropping the price. After all , the 110 Elite Precision is still going. I thought Savage was crazy when they made it. But people seem to be by buying them.

[charlie b]

I am not surprised to see the lack of CF in the lug/action area. It is not a great material in compression.

[Dave Hoback]

I am not surprised to see the lack of CF in the lug/action area. It is not a great material in compression.

Carbon Fiber is quite a bit stiffer/more ridged than Fiberglass. And vastly more than Hardwood. There are several stocks already made 100% through & through of Carbon Fiber.

[charlie b]

The CF will break down over time in compression.

[J.Baker]

Noticed the same thing right away. Does look kinda flimsy. But it’s the CF that is the long part. It’s amazing how this CF can be taken & still be so strong. However, the price is even more unreasonable with the stock not being 100% CF. We’ll see if your prediction comes to fruition. Although, I’m wondering if they don’t just end up dropping the price. After all , the 110 Elite Precision is still going. I thought Savage was crazy when they made it. But people seem to be by buying them.

Here's the thing about Savage... they can have 1,001 different models that are cataloged as "regular production models," but they only make what they get orders for, and they only do production runs once they have orders for X number of that model. Based on the current 2023 Savage catalog there are approximately 500 SKU's for centerfire rifles, 167 SKU's for rimfire rifles, 70 SKU's for shotguns and 45 SKU's for handguns giving a grand total of 782 SKU's. Now I don't know about you, but I've yet to find a gun shop that carries 1/20th of that selection on their shelves, much less all of it. Dealers are going to order what they feel is going to sell the fastest and/or in quantity - which is usually the more standard fair/no gimmick models. As such, distributors do the same as they're not going to order in a bunch of product that their dealers have little to no interest in because they don't think it will sell for whatever reason. So if the distributors aren't ordering it because the dealers aren't ordering it, who's Savage going to get quantity orders from so they'll actually produce some?

Back in the early 2000's Savage offered both a Model 10FP McMillan and a 10FP HS Precision in their Law Enforcement line (as well as a couple stocked with Choate stocks and the standard tupperware stocked model). On average, Savage produced less than 300 of each of the McMillan and HS Precision models per year according to Brian Herrick (Sales VP at that time). This was at a time when Savage's selection was still fairly slim and trim rather than resembling the menu at a Baskin Robin's as it does today. Today we have 5x the number of model variations that are "standard production" models and while their overall sales numbers are up compared to back then I'd feel comfortable betting that they make less than 500-1,000 units of their high dollar specialty models like these and the competition models like the 12 Benchrest, F-Class, F/TR, Long Range Precision or Palma, etc.

The higher the price gets and/or the more specialized the gun is the fewer number of people it's going to appeal to. Throw in the state of the economy and the current interest rates that have everyone watching their spending a lot more closely and I'm betting Savage has seen some noticeable drops in sales volume on these higher ticket models already which makes one question why they're launch two more at considerably high price points for the brand.

[shoots100]

That’s a fair point. But that wasn’t your argument. You simply said we were “Turn Bolt Fanatics using 200 year old rifle technology.” And I simply answered that the Straight Pull is 150 year old technology.

But now you are changing your argument to the Impulse being able to work correctly out of the box & the 110 will not, correct? Well, the 110 may have issues & it may not. However, what we know is all issues, whatever they may be, can be remedied. And it stands to reason than many more Savage 110’s function just fine when new, than those which have problems. If you are happy with your out of the box Impulse, I’m happy for you. I would not be. I’m quite happy with my hand built & extensively modified Model 10. With its wonderful 200 year old Turn Bolt it functions beautifully. Having minimal bolt lift which cost me little more than my time working on it. Not to mention all modifications performed were a pleasure for me, as I look at the hands on aspect as being part of the hobby. I know you have also performed modifications to your Impulse. And I commend you for it. I’m not against the Impulse. It simply does nothing for me. It’s just not a 110. Doesn’t have the rich history & extensive background of the 110. Being the oldest rifle still produced in the United States. Having seen extensive combat. And being the first rifle to utilize a barrel nut. A system so long being frowned upon, and now many franchises taking advantage of the same system. All these things mean something to me.

But it’s ok if we disagree. I only ask that you take care in spreading incorrect historical tech. :tea:
Savage has been producing the 110 since 1959 and you still need to upgrade a brand new rifle ?
They finally go it right in 2021 with the Impulse Predator.
Straight pull
Ambidextrous bolt handle
AICS magazine
Quick change barrel system
Fixed ejector

Straight pull design has been around awhile, but the design has improved, not stayed the same.
What has changed with bolt rifles, Less degree of bolt throw to make it more like a straight pull ?
The model 110 had to start somewhere and now the Impulse has taken the reigns to bring Savage into the future.
Long live Savage.

SJC

[Dave Hoback]

Savage has been producing the 110 since 1959 and you still need to upgrade a brand new rifle ?
They finally go it right in 2021 with the Impulse Predator.
Straight pull
Ambidextrous bolt handle
AICS magazine
Quick change barrel system
Fixed ejector

Straight pull design has been around awhile, but the design has improved, not stayed the same.
What has changed with bolt rifles, Less degree of bolt throw to make it more like a straight pull ?
The model 110 had to start somewhere and now the Impulse has taken the reigns to bring Savage into the future.
Long live Savage.

SJC

Well, ok shoots I’m glad you are happy with at least some of what Savage is putting out.… and as you know, we do have a wonderful section devoted to the Impulse. So, we can absolutely continue speaking of the merits of it over there. However, this is the 110 section. And we like to keep things 110 related here.