I was just wondering what you guys use as your black bear gun.? Im going on a bear hunt in Canada and am leaning towards my 375 winchester or my 307 winchester, but I enjoy shooting my leverguns. So what do you guys use.?
Printable View
I was just wondering what you guys use as your black bear gun.? Im going on a bear hunt in Canada and am leaning towards my 375 winchester or my 307 winchester, but I enjoy shooting my leverguns. So what do you guys use.?
Our bear population is growing rapidly where I live,so I bought a Savage 111 in 338wm for use on bears and elk.Toned down a little,it should do good on muleys too.
I load 250 gr. partitions on 72 gr. of IMR 4831,going 2700+ fps,packs a good wallop.
.30-30
I've used 30-06, and 43 mauser with black powder so far and bought a double barreled 45-70. The 375W or 307 will both do the job if you place your shot well. They're not that hard to kill. Ron.D
30-06, 270wsm. Have I shot any? No I haven't. Lol but my old boss shot one throught the ears with a 30-06. Turned the skull to jello.
Take your 307. That is about the same as a 308. 150s to 180s will drop a black in it's tracks. If you are hunting over bait it will be a short range affair. If your hunt is a stalk it could be 100 to 200 yards. The 307 is up to the task especially if you load the new rubber tip bullets that Hornaday came out with for the lever guns. Blacks are not that hard to kill as long as you keep it in the boiler room.
Best regards,
Grit
Killed 4 with my 308. 165gr SP's
35 Rem with 200 gr remington corelocks
I have a 116 Bearhunter in .338 win mag. I haven't hunted with it yet but I'm planning to use it for brown bear in Alaska. For black bears you can use just about any whitetail cartridge so it becomes more a choice of what gun you like rather than the cartridge. I have a Marlin Guide gun in .45/70 with ghost ring sights that's great for baited stands. I also have a Remington Model 742 in .30-06 with a 1.5X scope that I like a lot for bear hunting over bait. My old standby is a Savage model 110 in .308 win with a 3x9 leupold mounted on it but the last two bears I shot I used my bow. ;D
38-55 is my black bear/pig gun so your 375 Win would be more than enough. Just make sure you have tough bullets - some of the .375 bullets out there shed jackets and blow up even at 38-55 velocities!
I've only got one black bear, it was with a .338 RUM.
I use 450 marlin with 430 grain bullet outta a Browning BLR, which knocks the biggies up in Ontario, on their butts! ( It's quite the thumper to the shoulder, but I love that) My 358 win does the number on 'em too with a Barnes TSX 225. The bruins in Ontario need to be dropped quickly 'cuz it's SO thick up there, tracking is difficult at best. So the premise is put them down fast and hard or get a big enough exit hole so you can have enough blood to track 'em.
I know that this aint my thread but i was just wondering, would a 270 with 150gr corelokts work on colorado black bears??
A CA Black Bear with S&W 629 44 Mag.
450 Marlin and 338 Win. Mag.
coyoteslayer: ANY bullet will kill ANY animal if bullet placement is correct. My personal opinion is to put the animal down as quickly as possible in the most humane manner. I personally feel black bear should never be hunted with anything smaller than 35 cal. Yes I know there's alot of people that have killed black bears with 270 and 308. I don't like tracking a badly hit bear so I prefer my 450 marlin. U might wanna take a look at chuck hawks web site about "sectional density" of bullets needed for CXP 3 animals. I think the sectional density should be .280 for elk/black bear or CXP3 animals. Your 270 with 150 grainers is gonna be under that. Of course type of bullet matters as well. Use premium bullets when possible.
coyoteslayer: I mis-spoke. Looked up sectional density of 270 with 150 grain bullet. That WILL give you enough sectional density to bring down CXP3 size game like black bear. Your corelokt should work. Let us know what happens.
your 307 with 180's ought to do quite nicely. My lever choice, 358 in a Sav99
So you would not hunt a bear with anything less than 35 caliber. Hmmm. Don't know of a 35 caliber that would come close to the bone crushing, flesh devisation caused by a 7mm remington magnum with a 154 grain hornady spire point. Shoot a 300 pound bear looking at you in the chest and he will have two holes to do his business. Bill
Um.........35 Whelen, 350 Rem. Mag., 358 Norma Mag., 358 STA all would have bone crushing power on a bear. Now I'm not saying that a 7mm won't work but to each their own. He did say it was his opinion. I too feel that the 7mm is a little on the light side. Now if you go with some of the even heavier bullets in 7mm that have real high SD's then I would feel better about it. I don't feel that a 154 grain 7mm bullet is constructed tough enough to hold together well enough to penetrate enough in something as tough as a bear. Again, not saying it won't work, just saying there are bigger calibers out there that make me feel better.
Recall that we're talking about black bears here, not grizzlies, Kodiaks or prehistoric cave bears. Is anyone seriously saying they think that black bears are so tough that something like a 200 gr .30-06 (or any other potent .30 cal round) isn't a reliable stopper for them?
That hornady 154 grain spire pt is a interlock bullet. Will retain most of its weight as it exits length ways thru the bear. 300 winchester magnum, little bit better. Slightly bigger hole. I have shot at least 50 deer with 7mm mag and nothing kills as violently shocking as this caliber in my experience. Bill
Where we hunt in Ontario for the last 12 yrs, guys in our group shoot caliber's from 30-06 to 45-70. The 30 cal bears have gone farther once shot than the 45 cal bears. Not saying 30 cal won't work. I think it boils down to shot placement AND wound channel/exit hole. You all know the fat in the fall bruins plugs the entrance/exit wound yielding a meager blood trail to almost no blood trail at all. Heck, I shot one up there 375 lbs with 12 gauge slug taking out both lungs and you could see the spray of blood on the exit side. He still ran 70 yards after that. Maybe a .22 through the ears would work too. LOL Guess it's what you think will work for you taking into consideration sectional density of your bullet.
I never said a 7mm or 30 cal wouldn't work. And yes we're talking about black bears and they're not the same as grizzlies but they are still tough animals. As I said before, I personally feel better using something bigger and if I were to use a 7mm I would use a 162-175 grain bullet instead.
Thanks gunjunkie. And I'll let you guys know how it all pans out.
I'm going to go with a 20 guage shotgun, using slugs.
(shrug) I'm not saying your point is wrong, just the definition. I know jack all about shooting black bears, and you seem to know quite a bit. From what I've seen of them I would feel perfectly comfortable shooting them with my .30-06 and Barnes TSX 180 grain, but that's not based on anything other than my experience with similar-sized critters.
KeS
38-55
i would say the old dirty-30 would do just fine or maybe a 35 rem sence black bear arnt that big compared to there big brothers
How's that relevant to the topic of this thread?
30-30 works just fine for me. My shots may tend to be a little shorter than you are planning though.
I am planning my first bear hunt next fall and am already debating which gun for the job. This thread has been helpful. I'm torn between either my old heavy Weatherby in 300 weatherby mag, my Savage in 270wsm, or my TC Omega .50 throwing .290 grain Barnes TMZ's (my favorite deer gun!) or find a 325wsm barrel for my Savage...decisions decisions...
well if you have the money and dont mind doing it there is allways room in the safe for another barrel ;-} the 325 route sounds like a winner to me not that any ofyour wouldnt do the job just to have another option
I think the 338 RCM would work in your WSM action too. Yet another option for another barrel.
Where does this mindset come from other than obviously effective marketing that we need magnum this and WSM that to effectively, efficiently, and humanely kill deer and black bears?
What did folks kill bears with prior to all the magnum mania?
A post earlier said the last two bears were with a bow...and there's talk about the 7mm Rem Mag being too light? Really?
I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a bear with my .260 Rem or even .30-30. A buddy of mine put one down, DRT with a .30-06 last year. Stood 6'4" and over 500 lbs. DRT. No need for anti aircraft guns for black bears.
I wouldn't shoot a black bear beyond 150 yards with a .30-30, but the .260 is more than capable. 6.5x55 is one of the most popular calibers in Europe for game up to and including elk and moose. I'm sure those high BC/SD, long, heavy or caliber bullets will do the trick.
I'm a meat hunter and have no desire to blow my game in half or have the internal organs blended into a smoothie.
I don't care if it's a magnum or not, I still prefer a larger caliber. No they're not grizzlies, but black bears are still tuff and I want something that I feel more confident in penetrating their hide and muscle. If you feel fine with a 260 then go for it. You're entitled to your opinion and preferences the same as anybody else. A larger caliber with a heavily constructed bullet isn't going to blow the game in half, but it will penetrate deeply to get to the vitals. And the effectiveness of the 7mm wasn't questioned because of its speed or the size of the cartridge it was the size of the bullet being questioned. If you're comfortable with a 260, to each their own, but some feel more comfortable with a larger caliber. That doesn't mean that something smaller won't work too.
I don't hunt black bear but I live in Pennsylvania and know many who do. Any 30 caliber with a 150gr or heavier bullet will do the job just fine on a black bear. The 30-06 or the .308 are two good ones. Heavier ones will also work, along with a bow or cross bow.
Dave
( I don't hunt em as I don't like the taste of em)
Hornady puts Black bear in the same "medium game" (50-300 lb) as caribou, deer and antelope. Using their calculator (http://www.hornady.com/hits/calculator), one can conclude that a 6.5 mm (.260") bullet of standard construction (CoreLokt, PowerPoint, GameKing. Etc.) traveling faster than about 1700-1800 ft/sec should be adequate. This minimum velocity also happens to correspond with the threshold velocity for reliable expansion in these standard bullets.
By this standard, the 6.5 Grendel, 6.5 Creedmoor, .260 Remington, and larger should work. As it happens, a number of folks have taken black bear with the cartridges and are very pleased with the results.
But saying "X caliber and larger will work" isn't always the case. The .308 is mentioned, yet the 260 has superior ballistics and terminal performance. My point is that larger isn't always better. To each his own is right, but the "no replacement or displacement" argument doesn't apply to ballistics and KE. That's my point, not that you can use the minimum.
If you have a weatherby in the closet, I would not think twice to bring it. That's my all time favorite hunting cartridge.
I would agree with the above that the 260 or the 6.5x55 would both perform better than the .308 with proper bullets, but I mention the .308 because of its popularity.
Perhaps a large part of the problem with discussions like this one is that there's a fair amount of ambiguous use (and flat out misuse) of terminology going on, which results in a lot of miscommunication. When someone says "bigger" in this context, are they referring to bullet diameter (caliber)? Bullet weight? Energy? Some combination of the three? Are we talking about bigger size, or more "power"?
There's also an unfortunate tendency to use "caliber" as a synonym for "cartridge", which adds to the confusion. Speaking in terms of caliber is nearly useless in a discussion about adequate killing power.
"To each his own is right, but the "no replacement or displacement" argument doesn't apply to ballistics and KE." True because KE relies heavily on velocity. I am part of the "no replacement for displacement" school in that I believe a larger diameter bullet, at an equal velocity to a smaller diameter will hit harder. As we've said to each their own but I'll take the larger caliber for black bear and up. A 45-70, even when loaded hot doesn't have as much energy as a lot of other smaller caliber (bullet diameter) rounds but when it comes to large game it has proven it's penetration capabilities time and again. I really like the 6.5mm's a lot but personally won't use them on bears.
efm77
If the larger diameter bullet weighs less than the smaller diameter bullet, at the same speed, it doesn't hit harder.
Kinetic energy doesn't use diameter to calculate the energy.
It is all about mass and velocity.
EK = (1/2)mv2
Look.....it's just a black bear. Here in Pa they get killed every year by arrows, .260's, 30-cal of your liking, and big thumping-arse 8- mm or 45-70's loaded for (I can't help it) BEAR!! They all die when (and that's really the most important part) hit in the right place.
But, no matter how they die.....they still tase like..........bear. (ick).
Dave
I for one don't argue with physics.
However, the term "hit harder" is not a technical term and therefore can be interpreted in any number of ways.
From the point of view of my small brain, it seems pointless to debate subjective terminology like that.
I will suggest that a larger diameter bullet MIGHT (but not necessarily WILL in all cases)transfer a greater percentage of its Kinetic Energy to the target animal.
:nono: Please, please, lets be careful not to let this thread disintegrate into another thread similar to the .223 versus 5.56 NATO thread elsewhere on this forum.
Also, please remember that the OP asked what your FAVORITE (Caps and bold to emphasize, not because I am shouting) Black Bear caliber. You and I can have different favorite calibers and/or cartridges and be equally successful at the hunt. No argument of mine, regardless of how logical it seems to me at present, will change the fact that caliber X or cartridge Y is your favorite one for any specific purpose.:thumb:
"If the larger diameter bullet weighs less than the smaller diameter bullet, at the same speed, it doesn't hit harder."
Well I guess I didn't elaborate enough on that one. I certainly didn't mean a lighter bullet. You are correct there. That's one of the major points to having a larger caliber to me, to get more weight.
"Kinetic energy doesn't use diameter to calculate the energy.
It is all about mass and velocity.
EK = (1/2)mv2"
Already knew that. That was kinda my point. With a larger diameter you can get more mass because you can get heavier bullets. Look we all have our own opinions. How many times do I have to say it? Like I said I prefer larger diameters for larger critters but if you want to use a 6.5mm have at it. It's all personal preference. I never said they wouldn't work. I've tried to give me opinion and why I feel that way the same as everyone else here but never meant to start an argument or have formulas that I already know shoved at me to try to prove that you're right just because you like a different caliber from me. Sorry if I offended anyone. This thread has gotten way off topic here so I'm done.