What bullets you guys using? Midway seems to only have cast lead bullets left which I assume we dont want to shoot through these? Do they have to be a certain style to handle the higher velocities?
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What bullets you guys using? Midway seems to only have cast lead bullets left which I assume we dont want to shoot through these? Do they have to be a certain style to handle the higher velocities?
For target shooting the hornady 350's seem like the best priced. For serious rino loads barnes is about the best value. Swift are rated to 3,000+ fps but I've only found them in 325gr. Cutting Edge has a couple but they cost a bit more. The Punch Bullets (brass pin) look really cool but $3 a pop would be something for a specialized hunt.
I liked the 400gr seirra but wouldn't recommend launching it faster then 2150-2200fps they are hard hitting and extremely accurate at that velocity.
I think the 325 and 350gr hornady would be a good place to start load development.
Will look at the LGS this weekend and aee what they got. Midway only has the hornady 300gr xtp's on stock.
I shot some hornady FTX with the plastic tip, some XTPs and also some 335 copper plated lead from midway. All results were good. I was suprised about the plated bullets as they are not rated for over 1600 or so.
I was curious about thr plated ones for plinking, but didn't know how they would hold up.
I'll find out pretty quickly, I have a box of 250 left over from loading for the 50AE. I would think with the slow twist, they should be fine. Waiting on all my parts to get here. Jim
Im pretty sure that those are the same ones I have. Or atleast that is what they were intended for. The used to carry some 300 gr ones but have only had the 335 gr instock for over a year.
Got the barrel and brass on the way. Lgs has powder and primers. Not a lot of bullet choices though. Just cast lead and 350gr hornady hollow point xtp.
I have a variety of milsurp powders on hand, and will see what they do. Got to dig the chrono out again...
I tried I4350 pretty low velocity but fun easy recoil loads. Slower powders will leave a lot of un burnt powder in the barrel
I think to get over 2k fps something in the rl7-imr4064 burn rate range will be needed. I loaded some 350 XTP's with a healthy load of rl7 today. I will post the results tomorrow. Assuming the chronograph is up for it. Weathers sposed to be ideal woowhooo!
Ok ran a 9 shot volley 325gr XTP's
RL7 84grs
High 2475
Low 2347
Avg 2406
ES 128
SD 46
Running Into stiff bolt again. Had no issues with it at 78grs so just have to find the sweet spot. ES ran high my bad for using filler without finding just the right amount. Some were more compressed then others.
If I can get a consistent 2300+- fps without the stiff bolt I will be satisfied.
Was it a stiff bolt "lift" or a tough bolt "retraction" while trying to pull bolt back?
I've had a couple instances of tough to retract the bolt but no problems lifting bolt. Looking at the brass with the couple marks I have on it I assume I got a small rough spot on the chamber I need to look at but I certainly haven't ran any high pressure loads yet. Got these challenges with low pressure Trail Boss loads.
BT
Yeah retraction. Bolt lift wasn't bad except on one that pulled the crimp off. I need to inspect the chamber see if that scratched or scored anything. Looked quickly with the bolt out didn't see anything at a glance. But thats why I stopped with 9.
I need to trim some more new cases had one (with 10 firings on it) crack 25% of the way around the circumference. Might have been from the tough retraction. But anyway its time for some fresh ones.
Plan is to pull the barrel for closer inspection. Reset the headspace and load up a full round robin.from 78-82grains of rl7 find a final load with this combo.
Got most of the parts for my build here. What you guys using for dies? Any brand or set better than another?
Delete....
I have some RCBS dies and they work great, Blitzfike told me he used a set of 50 Beowulf dies, and they work even better than they S&W 500 dies he tried, I definitely have to look into that.
Dean
Dean, its the 50AE dies I used to get the neck tension down to what I want, I haven't done much with the 50 Beowolf dies yet. I'll be out of pocket for the next few days so my experimenting will be on hold until after that. Jim
OPS sorry about that, I knew it was one of those 50s.
Dean
Been doing some homework on this in the tractor today. If the 375 ruger case length is 2.58 and the 500 s&w case length is 1.65, how do you decap the spent brass? Or do it manually. Looking at case length between the 50 a&e, The 500 s&w, and the 50 beowulf, all about the same. Whats the difference in dies then if the all load .501" bullets?
I have a decapping die that I use for everything, I have only used the S&W dies so I can't help you there, I think it come down to you get use to and are familiar with they equipment and tools and dies that you have.
Dean
Decapping is easy, I just screwed the decapping stem down far enough to punch out the primer using the 500 SW sizing die. I have a couple of universal decapping dies, but didn't need them. The stem is actually below the top of the die, but for my initial purposes it worked OK. Also, the 500 SW die doesn't size the neck down enough for me, the neck tension with it is pretty loose. The 50AE sizing die reduces the neck enough to make a significant difference in bullet retention. With the 500 SW die, I can spin the bullet in the case after seating it, but crimping it did hold them in place, that makes for erratic ignition and more spread on the shot strings. I haven't tried the 50 Beowolf dies yet, but I suspect they will work as well as the 50AE, as I am using the same bullets in all three. I don't have a 500 SW currently, just the die set. Once I get a chance to set up the chronograph at the range, I'm going to do some serious load development. I have a wide variety of powders, including some surplus canister powder (not military surplus) and I'm going to be working up some load data for them as well. I have this mold - Lee 2-Cavity Bullet Mold C501-440-RF 500 S&W Magnum (501 Diameter) 440 Grain Flat Nose Gas Check - and a thousand Hornady gas checks, so I plan to do some serious work with the cast bullets as well. The chase for a good working load is what motivates me on these projects.. Dean sure got me in trouble with this one, I won't know when its done. I make bullet jackets from copper tube as well, so this is another machining project ahead of me. Thats for later after I get some load development done. Jim
Thanks for clearing that up Jim, I am always up for learning something new, and increasing my options.
Dean
Dean, since we are head-spacing on the cartridge case mouth, have you seen any stretching of the brass with the heavier loads? If this was a rimmed case, we would have head-spaced on the rim, but as a rimless and belt-less and no shoulder, case length becomes the standard. I have set the length of new brass in my batch as the standard length for this particular rifle. Whatcha think? Jim
I have seen so little stretching or brass flow it is not even a subject of conversation, I had some that were tad shorter, they grew to the chamber size and head space and stop right there.
Dean
I have to f/l size to chamber fired brass. I like the idea using new brass length keep us posted on that.
I am gonna try the an AE die. The crimp has weird effects as you mentioned and I have had some pull off when crimped hard.
Still chasing a rl7 load hopefully this week!
Told my neighbor its my deer rifle for this season :-)
I have been using the 50ae die as well. My Lee 500 S&W dies I couldnt get enough tension as stated. I had good luck using it as well.
Ordered the Lee 50 beowulf 4 die set. Has the factory crimp die which could be beneficial.
I've gone through 100 rounds of the new 375 basic brass doing measurements for length, and there is as much as 8 thousandths difference in some of the brass. I thought I had picked the shortest brass in the first lot to set as my final case length, but I see that I am going to have to work a little more to get everything to a standard length. Good thing setting head-space isn't hard here.. I'll have to mill a new case gage as my standard length is going to be shorter than the gage is... The factory crimp die from the 50 beowolf is the way to go from my experience so far, and the 50 beowolf sizing die brings the neck tension down to where I want it. I guess the 50AE brass is thicker and that makes it not ideal for this thinner brass in setting neck tension. More work to do before I can really get to load development.
I was using a standard belted mag shell holder instead of ordering the 375 ruger shell holder. No problem except that the loose fit left protruding primers. I fixed that with the RCBS universal hand primer, and it fixed the problem with misfires. Hitting the primer without it being fully seated usually just drove it deeper into the pocket without igniting it. A second strike would always fire it, but that's not what we want. If my shell holder ever gets here I'll see what that does. I'm using a Lee two cavity 440 grain gas check mold and they seem to work really well in this round. Much better bullet retention than with the jacketed bullets. I run them through a Lee 5.01 sizer die to seat the gas checks and size to proper dimension. I'm still only playing with IMR-4895 at this point. I need to wait for warmer weather before I go out with the chrono and press to develop any other loads. Jim
How much 4895 are you running with 440 grain bullets?
Right now I'm at 70 grains. No pressure signs and primers are still rounded. Pretty good thump, but still low on the load. I had a pocket gopher poke his head out of a hole when I was coming back from the shop with the rifle, I popped him from about three feet away. Could find no sign of the carcass, but after 5 days the hole is still open. I guess that was overkill, but it sure did work.
I meant to add that the 440 grain bullet actually weighs 465 grains with the alloy i'm using and the gas check. These are fairly hard, water quenched. If just air quenched, they are somewhat softer.
Question for you guys. Tried loading up a few rounds tonight and having problems with the factory crimp die on the Lee .50 beowulf die set. Trying to set the crimp and the bullet still turns in the case after the crimp. Pushed a bit harder and the case gets rippled. Whats the method or cure for this?
I use a .500 S&W taper crimp. Have the same thing occasionally. Probably not an issue if ya aren't storing indefinitely. But I just pull harder as you did no issue with ripple. Have had crimp pull off a few times n attributed it to crimping to hard?¿?
What brand dies are you using? My Lee 500 S&W would do this as well. Got pissed off, crunched some cases and tried the 50AE and it worked like a champ even though the round is slighty tapered (50AE), but I guess it doesnt matter too much as it basically is only seating and crimping.
So basically all you need is a 50AE crimp die, and not the whole set, is this right?
Dean
Using the Lee set. Havent had the crimp pull off. Just seemed too loose that i could spin the bullet. Maybe its not an issue though. Also I do believe that Dean menrioned stuffing cotton ball on top of the powder to hold the bullet up while crimping? I have one that the byllet fell in during the crimp.
I use to use the cotton ball method, now I just fill the case with powder so the bullet can't drop or sink into the case while I am crimping it, powder is a much better holder and I get the coal I want by adjusting the powder level. I kid you not.LOL
Dean
Still using H335?
335,322, IMR3031, 10X, RL7, H4198, The next powder on my list to try is H110, I would like to find a powder that I could use 70gr of and still get the velocity I want, so I could get at least get 100 rounds from a pound.
Dean
Update on my progress with this beast. I'm using the 50 Beowolf dies, sizing with the 500 SW die doesn't give me enough neck tension, neither does the 50AE die so I've been using the beowolf die to neck size the cases. If I need to full length size the cases, it will have to be with the 500 SW die and so far I have avoided mutilating it. With my mild load of 70 grains of IMR-4895 and the 465 grain cast bullet, performance has been good so far. I did have to go back and trim all my cases to the smallest length found in the virgin brass, which turned out to be 2.655" in length. I had too much difference in lengths on my cases and the long cases jammed into the rifling, created big jumps in pressure while the shorter cases would have to be struck two or three times with the firing pin to get them to fire. I tore the bolt down and set the pin protrusion to max, trimmed the cases to one length and now all is fine. I machined a die to swage bullets at .502 diameter, the only nose punch I've made to date makes a semi wadcutter type shoulder on the bullet. I have to work the swaging in steps at the pivot point of the old rock chucker as it doesn't have enough mechanical advantage to swage it all in one throw. I guess a hydraulic swaging press is in my future to make these bullets. Running the plated bullets through this die gives better neck retention with the slight increase in diameter, but I'm not sure how well the SWC bullet nose is going to work. Not so well for long range I'm thinking...
Dean, I would be interested as to see how the h110 works. I also have 300MP and lil gun that I run in my 50ae ar15s as well. 300MP makes fireballs but the lil gun seems to do more with less. I have 8lbs of H110...we talked a little about this when I called you. The 50ae seat/crimp die works for me.
You probably did tell me, but what can I say, they old grey matter she ain't what she use to be, ain't what she use to be, many long years ago.
Dean
Can you elaborate on the 81 catapult?
The issue here is neck tension. What you are neck sizing with isn't bringing the neck diameter down enough to hold the bullet in place. The 500 S&W and the 50AE both have very thick necks and the sizing die is honed to make the bullet tension right for that brass. I had to go to my 50 Beowolf die to get enough tension to grip the bullets. I'm using the beo dies for both neck sizing and crimping. Dean's cotton balls work OK for holding the bullet out there, but you still don't have enough neck tension and that effects the internal ballistics of the powder burn. I am getting much more consistent ignition with the necks sized down with the 50 Beowolf sizing die. Hope this helps you understand what's going on. Jim
Edit, I'm also using bullets bumped up to .502 with a home made swage die.
I would have to look at my reloading books but regarding the neck tension....... run the brass threw the taper crimp die without a bullet. Run it up far enough that it sizes down the neck for the desired length for which you are going to seat your bullet. After you size it that far into the taper crimp die the neck of the brass should be too small to seat a bullet so now you can run it over the mandrel in the expender die. Pretty sure this is what I did. It should get you plenty of tension on the seated bullet.
BT
Yep that's what I did! Found the thread too. Check post #6
http://www.savageshooters.com/showth...space-on-mouth