I'm currently using a Hornady beam scale but was considering buying a digital scale.
Stay with what I'm using or upgrade to a digital scale. If upgrade to digital which one is accurate and more important, consistent ?
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I'm currently using a Hornady beam scale but was considering buying a digital scale.
Stay with what I'm using or upgrade to a digital scale. If upgrade to digital which one is accurate and more important, consistent ?
Depends on how much you load and what you want. Electronic scales are great, they have there purpose and come with a few quirks. So do beam scales. My beam scales are used during load development and are tricked out by Scott Parker. The RCBS scale is the best value and the combo chargemaster is very nice. I use it to throw my hunting and competition rounds checking the comp stuff on the beam. That might be overkill but it is how many of us do it around here and it speeds things up. Some guys have professional scales that cost close to 1000 bucks. These guys are in the 1000 yd F/ open class.
What kind of quirks are you referring to with digital ?
More with the combo's but with respect to the scales, many of the cheaper priced ones you deal with drift, hunting, accuracy and resolution.
My experience with digital scales (3 of them) is that they don't work well with a powder trickler. They seem to have trouble recognizing small increments being added slowly. I still use a beam scale for that.
They work well for weighing charges thrown from a powder measure.
I like to add powder myself and do not want an autotrickler.
I can handle it being off .2 of a grain, but drifting .3-.6 does not work for me.
I also prefer 110v over battery.
PS: Main reason for wanting to go digital is because I can stand over it and read the display quickly.
I use an RCBS beam I set my loads using Lyman Shooter's Weight Check Set. I don't bother with the graduated marks on the scale I just put the weights in that add to my load and set the scale from there. I have a Lyman 1200 and an RCBS digital neither one seems to hold zero or reacts quickly to power trickled in.
I have a dillon and like it...i dont use it for powder but i have checked it against my Scott Parker beam several times and the dillon reads .1 less everytime...40g reads 39.9 45.5g reasds 45.4 ect....it dont drift unless the air is moving.
I can't count the number of times over the years that I've had to re-do some work in progress because a digital scale went off calibration. In my experience, the biggest flaw with digital is that you never know when it's accurate. Even if you start with calibration, as the electronics warm, it drifts, sometimes substantially. And if a load cell goes quietly T.U. you can be WAY off. That's why i like beam scales. Nothing works as consistently as GRAVITY against a mechanical device. I own several Ohaus triple beam scales for gram weights, but for loading I use a Hornaday beam scale mounted in a platform with felt pads for feet. It resolves down to a couple of granules. My friend has the full feature Hornaday electronic with autotrickler, but he always backs up with an RCBS beam scale to double check, and he doesn't load for accuracy, just fun.
Does Scott Parker refurbish beam scales? If so, how can I get in touch with him?
I agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas10
He only does scales with the main beam weight and the thin weight on the end toward the pan....rcbs old laymans ectQuote:
Originally Posted by cowtownup
1-661-346-1199 leave a message and he'll get back to you
Enlighten me....who is Scott Parker ?
TEXAS10,
Can you post some pics of your mounted system and explain why ?
I've used a beam, a Frankford Aresenal digital, and now a GemPro 250. I much prefer the GemPro, although a GOOD beam is a close second. The Frankford Arsenal digital is cheap, and would work well if you aren't loading precision long range, or anything else you want to be super precise with. As was said earlier, it starts to lose it's zero, or drift, as it warms up. It is battery powered though, and has an auto shutoff feature that I don't like. You can't turn it on and let it warm up first unless you babysit it and touch it every couple minutes, or it'll turn off.
I then decided I was going to spend a bit more on a nicer scale, and it had to have AC power and no auto shutoff. I picked up a GemPro 250. I plug it in the day before I'm going to load so it has a full day to get warmed up. It's super accurate, down to .02 grains. So far I've been very happy with it. Hope this helps.
See if I can get this to post.
Nope
I'll work on this some more and see if I can get the pics to post.
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/n...psrpxxgk8t.jpg
It appears that you did that so you'll have a consistant flat surface (bumping, etc) and the bungee is to keep it firm in place?
Thanks for taking the time to post the pic.
Sorry, but I can't seem to get the pics to post directly.
Dang, the photo did not post like that when I checked it. Now I'm totally lost.
Anyway......yes, as you said.
Scott Parker is the man when it comes to the very best beam scale money can buy...1 kernel of H100V moves my beam...you can google Scott Parker beam scales and do a little reading and you'll see....great thing is when you buy a scale from him it comes with a life time warranty just like the big name guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXCOONDOG
I agree with Texas10. The problem with digital scales is that you never know when they are accurate. I have a GemPro 250 which I like very much. However, I wasn't pleased with the SD's and ES's I was seeing with the chrono. I did several test comparing the GemPro to my RCBS balance beam. Much to my surprise, I found that I got consistently tighter groups with smaller SD's and ES's with the balance beam scale. I still used the GemPro to weigh bullets and cases, but rely on the balance beam scales for powder.
I just got off the phone with Scott Parker and I will have one of his tuned Redding scales in two weeks.
Thanks all.
i have a gempro 250 as well and the gempro does not handle trickling at all. it is a very good, very precise scale, but trickling totally trips it up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimeg
an aws gemini-20 is very nearly as accurate as the gempro 250, is a fraction of the price, and the gemini-20 handles trickling fine.
You never know if any scale, beam or digital is accurate without using verified accurate check weights at a target weight or across it's total weight range. Without them you only know what a scale is indicating.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimeg
Bill
How much for one of those tuned? I thought he only worked on scales that were sent to him and that he had stopped doing any tune jobs ever since ohaus went chinese.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXCOONDOG
Older Redding for $175 TMD and 2-3 weeks for delivery.
I emailed him (vld223@yahoo.com) with my cell and he called me
You made the right decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXCOONDOG
Most of you fellas having problems with your beam scales probably bought one used, unknowingly damaged or you left the scale assembled for long periods of time. The fulcrum gets damaged making zero and repeatability impossible to maintain. You can make huge improvements to a damaged fulcrum with a fine (diamond) hone. If your having problems get out a magnifying glass and look at the contact edges of the fulcrum. You don't want to remove very much metal and it is really an art. Do yourself a favor if you don't already, Disassemble your scale when your done and reassemble it carefully each time you use it..
Do people not like digital scales because they are digital, or are there some good models that are just as good as beam scales.
I’m curious, cause I ordered an RCBS Range Master 750, but won’t have it till later this week. It works on 110 v or a 9v battery. I chose it from a lengthy discussion in another forum at $119 over a $53 scale I was going to get.
Here is a scale for you....Sartorius GD503
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-WMTxCRkvnN...artorius-2.jpg
Please send me a check in the mail. :crazy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinhood
Unfortunately, the Sartorius GD503 has been discontinued and no longer in production as of May 2013. The Sartorius jewelry line was phased-out and at this time there is no direct replacement.
Somethings fishy. You have an omega trickler, a sartorius scale and a lee powder measure...... Hmmm just kiddin. Nice setup!
i agree...i took a small plastic storage box lined it with foam and cut a hole for the scale to rest in so that it is secure and covered/protected from dust and the only time its assembled is when throwing charges then it goes back in the box.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinhood
How about some pics ?Quote:
Originally Posted by LongRange
ill post a couple tonight.
I use a plastic bag Maw got some pillow covers in. Its low tech but works. ( and cheap!) As far was unloading the beam the old Lyman D7s had a "lifter", I just slip a piece of foam between the beam and bearing support towers. I don't disassemble them between use.Quote:
Originally Posted by LongRange
This is the new old stock "Made Here" 505 I recently tuned, its 100% dead on from zero to 500grs using my check weights verified-recalibrated by the tech in our ISO lab before I got lazy....errrr....retired. :p
http://i62.tinypic.com/v48jfm.jpg
Bill
lol that will work to...and nice scale!!Quote:
Originally Posted by BillPa
the cheap scale box...
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/.../photo1-78.jpg
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/.../photo1-79.jpg
and this is where it rides when loading....it puts my scale just about eye level....
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/.../photo3-42.jpg
The KISS rule works for me.
Thanks for taking the time to reply and post pics.
a little tip from Scott...when you set your scale up each time before you put the pan on take your finger and push down on the pan rest a couple of times so that the beam weights settle into place then set your pan on and zero the scale then when you set your weights to throw charges do the same thing as above. i was having issues with holding exact zero and called scott he said send it back and he would fix it...he called 3 days latter and said there was nothing wrong with the scale that he had run it with all his check weights from 1g up to 450gs and asked me if i was doing the above...i wasnt and havent had an issue since.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXCOONDOG
How many of you use a precision weight instead of the weight that comes with the scale? Does it make that much of a difference?
they make check weights that are much cheaper than the weight you posted...the thing with weighing powder is that you will most likely never notice the difference in a few kernels of powder from shot to shot as so many other things play into it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Geo_Erudite
Two udder sings.....Quote:
Originally Posted by LongRange
Gently press down on the 5-10 grain poise (which ever the scale has) to make sure it seated in the notch in the beam.
Second, when moving it lift it over the notches instead of bumping it over them especially if its an aluminum beam. Wear or knock the top off any one or more of them and any sense of accuracy and linearity will be out the window.
Bill
Good info guys. I'll try it when I get it.
Good information here. I love this site, I ALWAYS learn something!
Earlier I mentioned lifting the poises instead of bouncing them over the notches especially if its an aluminum beam. This is or can be the result.Quote:
Originally Posted by GaCop
http://i59.tinypic.com/rj0hoh.jpg
Knock or wear off the tops of the notches and any sense of accuracy and linearity will be impossible. That paper weight was from an old well used and abused Lyman D5 I bought at a yard sale for five bucks, he was asking 10! :p The only way to compensate for that type of damage is by zeroing a scale at the intended target weight.
For example, if the target weight is 45.5 grs, place the combination of check weights in the pan equal to 45.5, set the poises to 45.5 then zero the scale at that weight. Forget the unweighted zero altogether.
In fact its not a bad procedure to follow to check-verify a beam's accuracy, new, used or abused at a given target weight setting.
Bill
I used an RCBS 5-0-2 scale for years. It wasn't until this recently I noticed it wasn't holding zero anymore (ever?), it was taking forever to load large batches, and I hated having to build the bench around reading it at eye level.
I did my homework on the lyman, hornady, and rcbs digital dispensers. I went with the Lyman Gen 6 as it seemed to have the least frills and some common sense features built in. Mainly the auto dispense. I've loaded about 800-900 rounds with no issues to date.
It drops powders like Varget and 4064 to 1/10th of a grain with the "restrictor" installed. With a little tap on the dispensing tube it will drop a kernel at a time and I can quickly achieve the perfect charge. (I tried a ball powder (2460) and it was awful because it sprayed the stuff everywhere). Once a charge is dropped, there is enough time to seat a bullet before the next charge is ready.
That said, talk is cheap and the proof is in the pudding ie the target and chronograph. I haven't had the opportunity to compare digital vs beam scale velocities but will very soon. Accuracy has stayed the same, maybe a slight improvement in that I'm seeing fewer fliers.
I'm going to do a full write-up on this I think.
Bill
Interesting thread. I use my RCBS balance scale on a Harbor Freight work bench that is pretty level, but the top is not absolutely flat. I have to zero the scale whenever it's moved slightly. As it is, it's within .1 grain from my Hornady digital scale. I never keep it covered and don't disassemble after use. I can see the utility in that.
I am sending my RCBS 10-10 to him Monday $85 shipping back included.Quote:
Originally Posted by LongRange